Moderator: Welcome to Capitol Chat. I'm your moderator, Political Editor Brad Shannon, and we're speaking today with state Republican Party Chairman Chris Vance. Vance recently won re-election to his third two-year term as party leader. He's played a very high-profile role over the past election cycle, including work that led to Republican gubernatorial candidate Dino Rossi's decision to challenge the election results in court.

Moderator: Tell us a little about yourself and how you got into politics, Chris.

Vance: I've lived here all my life, graduated from Sumter High in Pierce County. As long as I can remember I was interested in politics. When I was young I worked on Congressman Rod Chandler's staff. I ran for the state house in 1988 and lost, but two years later came back and won. I was 28 when first elected to the house. Served there for three years and then was elected to King county council, where I served for eight years. I then was elected chairman of state party. Youngest person ever elected to King County Council and youngest ever elected, as far back as records go, to state party chair. My wife and our two kids live in Auburn.

Moderator: What is the party's role in the election contest? Who is actually in charge? We understand Rossi is named as the plaintiff, but the GOP is paying all the bills for lawyers and at times appears to be running the show.

Vance: It has been a team effort of the Rossi campaign, the Republican National Committee, Republican Governors Association and the state Republican Party. There are financial advantages to the state party paying the bills, because we can accept unlimited donations and basically can use non-campaign soft dollars for this, whereas the Rossi campaign would have to use hard dollars. The ultimate opinion-maker is Dino, J. Vander Stoep, his chief of staff, is next, then me. Our staff has been working on this, but it's really more than anything else a team effort.

Moderator: Have you ever had to push Dino to keep going?

Vance: Nope, we never have. I don't know what it would be like if that happened. He doesn't make the day-to-day decisions, but he does make the big decisions. For instance, it was his decision to contest the election. And there's never been a major disagreement amongst the team.

Adriel, Bothell: Putting the duties of your job aside, do you feel confident that Dino Rossi won the gubernatorial election? And if the 2004 election were overturned and the Republicans lost the subsequent revote, what would be your next move?

Vance: I don't believe anyone knows who truly won this election. Somebody won the governor's office by less than 500 votes, I don't believe anyone knows whether that was Rossi or Gregoire. I am confident that if we had counted the votes under rules used for recounts in the past, Dino Rossi would be governor today. Two things were done differently in these recounts: 1. The Supreme Court changed rules and allowing King County to re-examine votes they had discounted.

Moderator: The Secretary of State's office says that's standard practice.

Vance: They are wrong. Guidelines issued in the past by Secretary of State Ralph Monroe would never have allowed that. The so-called saftey valve was invented by Sam Reed. The second thing that was done differently was that King County changed its rules, at the request of the Democrats, on what constitutes an overvote and an undervote, how much of a mark a voter needs to leave on paper for it to count as a vote. In the middle of the recount, the Democrats asked King County to change the rules on that, and it resulted in Gregoire picking up dozens of votes.

My answer is only God knows who actually won the election, but I am confident that if we had counted the normal way, Dino would have won.

As for the second part of the question, if we are successful in getting a second election I think Dino will win, but if he does not we will pull ourselves together and prepare for the next election. In politics, there's always another election around the corner. You keep on fighting because there's nothing else you can do.

Moderator: Democrats made much of a new Elway Poll yesterday, saying it shows voters oppose a revote in the governor's race and that two-thirds think the state (and presumably Rossi, too) should "accept the results of the election and move on." What is your reaction to that?

Vance: I have not seen that poll yet.

Moderator: Sixty-three percent felt it was time to move on, 33 percent wanted a revote, but Stuart Elway said today that he thinks those numbers could change if Rossi prevailed in court.

Vance: 1. I have not seen that poll. 2. I have seen lots of previous polls showing the overwhelming majority of citizens believe Rossi won the election and want a new election.

Moderator: This new poll suggests the public is turning against your cause. Are you concerned?

Vance: I haven't seen the poll, but I think this issue has died down in the public conciousness, and one day the public will wake up to a huge headline, "... ORDERS NEW ELECTION," and it will be like dumping gasoline on smoldering embers, and you will see the fires raise up again. And you will see public sentiment in favor of a new election. It's died down and I think the public has lost track of this, but I'm confident they will support it if a new election is declared.

Carl, Vashon: Should we have new elections every time they are close, or only when a Democrat wins?

Vance: There's never been an election like this in American history. This is the closest gubernatorial election in U.S. history. Close elections are not unusual, but 109 people deciding out of 3 million is unusual. Even with that, we would not contest the election unless we knew it was fatally flawed. We are amazed at the number of felon voters. We are amazed King County can't match every signature to a voter, and that they have acknowledged voges made illegally. You cannot contest every election, but the unique circumstances surrounding this election are why we are contesting it.

Moderator: The BIAW was looking into irregularities with felon voters immediately after the election, and I understand they have been working with your party since then, but there was not expression of concern over felon voting until the Supreme Court ruled the extra 500 votes could be counted in King County. Why not bring it up earlier?

Vance: You have to separate those issues. We've been expressing concern about King County's practicies since Election Day. On Election Day our lawyers talked to Dean Logan about our observers watching provisional ballots being cast illegally. I've had multiple press conferences about problems with King County.

With regards to felons specifically, we had no idea how many felons were on the voting rolls until we were able to get the State Patrol's database of convincted felons and the final list of poeple who voted in King County, and those documents were not available until mid-January. So there's no way we could have complained about felon voters earlier than that, but we have been complaining about problems with King County elections literally from Election Day.

Moderator: You complained, but you didn't distrust the outcome until Rossi was losing.

Vance: I didn't say that. We've been complaining about the elections in King County since day one.

Moderator: But it was her lawfyul right to seek a third count.

Vance: Yes, just as it is our lawful right to contest it.

Jahn, Tumwater: Why weren't you as incensed about voting irregularities when Bush stole the national election in 2000?

Vance: What we've heard from many Democrats is, "what about Florida?" One, what happened in Florida has no relation to this election. It is disturbing to me that many Democrats will acknowledge there are problems with Washington state elections, then smile and say it's payback for Florida. I hear that all the time, especially on talk radio.

Second, the story of florida is now full of myth. George W. Bush did not steal Florida. Remember, they counted all the votes in Florida, and Bush won. They recounted all the votes in Florida, and Bush won. Then, the Democrats went to court and convinced the Florida Supreme Court to allow them to do hand recounts in heavily Democratic counties in Florida, contrary to state law, and the Supreme Court ruled they could do that. This was an attempt on the part of the Democrats to steal Florida. The Bush campaign appealed to the (U.S.) Supreme Court and won. If anyone can be accused of stealing the election. the election in Florida, it would be the Democrats.

Moderator: Is that how you view Gregoire's victory? Theft?

Vance: No ... Gregoire would not be governor today if the state Supreme Court had not changed the rules on the recout and if King County had not changed rules on overvote. Those were both things pushed by the Democrats, Christine Gregoire, Dean Logan, and Bill Huennekens. So, both of those things were legal.

Irene, Shelton: How can we work toward an election system that will restore confidence in the people? I have been an election board worker for at least 35 years and have always been told that whenever a discrepancy occurs and someone challenges it, a revote almost certainly will be called. The box of unsecured ballots and the late military ballots certainly raise the red flag, and a revote should have been done.

Vance: Well, one, I think that holding a successful election contest that results in a new election will do more to restore trust and confidence than anything else.
Second, the Legislature needs to enact meaningful reform. Right now they are going 180 degrees in the wrong direction. Going to an all vote-by-mail system will increase innacuracies and the possibility of fraud, not decrease them. It is the worst thing the Legislature can do right now.

Moderator: What is your strategy for stopping that legislation?

Vance: Elect more Republicans. We hope they listen. We can't stop the democratically controlled Legislature from doing whatever they are going to do. With mail ballots, the only fallback you have is signature verification, and right now signature verification in this state is a flat-out joke.

Lisa, University Place: I voted for Dino Rossi and couldn't believe he didn't win. What's the status of all of the lawsuits and court-related issues, and when do you expect the trial?

Vance: Right now the wheels of justice are grinding forward slowly. The judge will set a trial date when both parties are ready. We believe we will be ready in April. It will be a short trial, so I'm hoping that by my birthday, May 1, we'll have a lower court decision on this. We think we will win, and then it's on to the state Supreme Court.

Rod, Olympia: If you win, does that mean any laws the current governor signs would be void?

Moderator: And I would add, do you think they should be?

Vance: No, unfortunately. Our lawyers believe Gregoire is the legal governor, and any actions she takes have the force of law, and I think that's the way it has to be. We're just hoping this is the only session in which she has the place of governor.

Moderator: What kind of job is Gregoire doing as governor? What do you think of the job she's doing?

Vance: I am an Olympia veteran and I know the real Legislature session has not yet begun. We have not yet seen Gregoire take a firm position on the big issues that matter right now, and that is the state budget. When we see the real budget and the real tax plan, we'll know where she stands. In the meantime, she revealed herself to be a politician.

Stem cell research -- during the campaign she said she wanted to commit billions of dollars to stem cell research. Rossi said it was just a sham to get the issue of stem cells into the campaign, and he was right. The final thing we've seen so far is that she is a really weak governor. She doesn't believe she really won. The special interests funded her hand recoun,t without which she wouldn't be there. I belive she's going to be bullied by the Legislature leadership, and right now I think (Democratic Speaker of the House) Frank Chopp is running Olympia.

Moderator: One election reform being proposed would send the Secretary of State's Office to review county elections departments' work on a periodic basis, perhaps every three years. Ironically, it was a Republican controlled Legislature that cut the funding for the program and passed a bipartisan bill that made such inspections optional -- both actions coming in 1997, when Dino Rossi was in the Senate. Don't Republicans share blame in creating what Rossi and others call an elections "mess?"

Vance: No, that's not the underlying problem here. The underlying problem has everything to do with King County.

Moderator: Will you run against Democratic U.S. Senator Maria Cantwell next year?

Vance: We are going to field a very strong candidate against Maria Cantwell. At this point I'm not sure who that's going to be. I don't think there's going to be any serious move towards running a U.S. Senate campaign until the situation with governor is cleared.

Moderator: Is that because Dino would be a candidate?

Vance: Yes. Dino has said he's committed to the governor's race, but for obvious reasons the national party and Republicans in the state are going to turn to Dino if -- for whatever reason -- he doesn't become governor, and ask if he'd be willing to run for U.S. Senate. Once we know in April, May or June what is going to happen with the trial in Chelan, that will make the U.S. Senate race clearer.

Moderator: Are you trying to keep people out of the race now so that it's clear for Dino?

Vance: I don't have to do that now, because everyone knows the situation.

I can't say I won't run for office again someday, I have a great job right now. If the Republican team, including Dino, asked me to be the candidate for U.S. Senate, of course I would be flattered and would probably agree to do that. But for now I'm completely focused on the job I have, which is a great job.

George, Shelton: What's the State Republican position on Initiative 872, the top-two primary for partisan offices, passed by the voters last November? Will the party take it to court?

Vance: We opposed 872. We believe we have a right to nominate a single Republican for each office. We have made it clear for several years now that if the state does not conduct a primary election which results in the nomination of a single Republican for each office, we will hold a convention to do so. Those are the adopted rules of the Republican Party. I think we will hold conventions this year and we will have litigation over this issue, which we believe and the Democrats believe is unconstituational.

All we want is the same system used everywhere else in America, where Republicans choose the nominees of the Republican party and Democrats choose the nominees of Democratic Party. That doesn't seem too much to ask.

Moderator: Would you attack the law in court, or sue candidates who call themselves Republicans but haven't been blessed by the party?

Vance: I don't want to get into the individual suit strategy, but I believe there will be litigation. Anything we will do will be in conjunction with Libertarians and Democrats. The strategy is evolving, but has not evolved yet.

Paul, Olympia: The tone of political "conversation" seems to have devolved into gradeschool-level name calling. Can we all move beyond name calling or is that what gets votes?

Vance: I don't accept his premise. I don't think the level of political argument is any worse now than it was 24 years ago when I first got involved in politics. People constantly express concerns about negative campaigning, but I really don't think it's ever changed. Politics is a tough business which involves, by its nature, argument. Some don't like it but that's what politics has always been.

Rita, Lacey: I know it is your job, but some of the things you say are just really inflammatory and not even believable by local Republicans like me.

Vance: I don't believe I have adopted that tone. I don't agree with the premise of the question. Without her being more specific, I'm at a loss to answer that. I will say I have the confidence of Dino Rossi and our congressional delegation and all of our statewide elected Republicans, all of whom endorse me as chairman. I have been elected three times by the grassroots of our party.

Chris, Olympia: This war has all the hallmarks of being this generations Vietnam. What legislation, as party chair of the Republican Party, are you going to put forth to aid the transition of our soldiers back into civilian life?

Vance: That question implies the people were drafted, but every single soldier in Iraq volunteered. And I don't think they view it as a burden but as a privelege, because it's their career of choice. And the armed forces has policies in place to help the transition. I think the quesiton is misguided and has a Vietnam-era feel to it. Many of these troops are career soldiers, they probably don't want to transition to civilian life.

Kim, Olympia: Does the Republican Party think that a man's reproductive freedom should be controlled by the government? If not, why not?

Vance: The Republican Party is a huge diverse organization. Most Republicans are pro-life and our platform reflects that. But not all Republicans share that view. For republicans who are pro-life, their view is based on the beliefs that life begins at conception and that the child in the womb is entitled to the protection of the government.

But, again, most Republicans are pro-life, not all. We are not monolithic on this issue. You are not allowed to be pro-life and be in the Democratic Party, but we have Republican pro-choice elected officials. It's very hard to find a pro-life Democrat elected official.

Moderator: Many Republicans like Rossi talk about personal responsibility, yet when it has come to the elections mistakes in the recent election, we've not seen the GOP willing to admit when it overstated its claims. For instance, Republican forces once claimed hundreds if not more than 1,000 military voters were disenfranchised in November, yet few if any real solid cases of disenfranchisement have been documented. Were you wrong?

Vance: No, and the late mailing of absentee ballots will be brought up in court. This was the last state in the nation to mail its ballots to servicemen and women overseas. Many military personnel lost their right ot vote, and it's one issue we are suing over.

Moderator: Do you see a federal legal case if the state election contest doesn't go your way?

Vance: We have never ruled out a federal option, but we believe that our best chance of securing a new election is in state court.

Moderator: You once promised to bring the GOP headquarters to Olympia, once you got the party disentangled from that real-estate deal your predecessor, Don Benton, executed. Your offices are still in Tukwila. What happened?

Vance: No I didn't, the state committee in 2000 voted to move the office to Olympia, but our lease had not expired here. This fall, the state committee voted to eep the office here in tukwila, and we signeed a three year lease to keep us here. State committee members are elected for a two-year term, so the decision in 2000 was reversed by a new group of people who came into office after the 2002 and 2004 elections. So our office will remain here in South Center for the next three years.

Moderator: Thank you very much for your time, Chris, you've been very generous.

Moderator: Tune in to Capitol Chat again tomorrow at 12:30, when Gov. Christine Gregoire will answer readers' questions. We've been working for a month to get Dino Rossi for a future session, and we'll keep readers posted on that.